A question about Mary Magdalene

[Kris Doyle]

I thought for a long time that she was, but then it was pointed out to me that even though Lazurus had a sister named Mary, they lived in the city of Bethany, while Mary Magdalene means Mary of Magdala. I wondered if Magdala could have been where she was born, but she later lived in Bethany (when Jesus was ministering)...but then would Jesus have been called Jesus of Bethlehem instead of Jesus of Nazareth, since He was born in Bethlehem but raised in Nazareth? If Mary Magdalene was also Mary the sister of Lazarus, then she was the one who anointed Jesus' feet in Simon the Leper's house. But if these were two different Marys, then I've been wrong for a long time! I know it's not that big of an issue (unless it can help break the DaVinci myth), but what do you guys think?

--Kris Doyle

[gimp80995]

OOOOH......I should know this one. It was in the sermon at my church like two weeks ago. I do remember that Mary Magdalene, and Mary of Bethany are the same person, and it does have to do with the fact that she moved to Bethany.

The example with Jesus, I believe he was refered to as Jesus of Nazareth because that's where he grew up and where his family was. Otherwise everytime he entered a new town his name would've changed.

I'll work on breaking the DaVinci myth next time

Peace Out

-Gimp

[Blipadouzi]

I'll work on breaking the DaVinci myth next time

I hope this is one of your jokes...cause I hate to break it to you...but the DaVinci code is a work of fiction...

It never existed...and the part that has been released to "seem" like the real thing is a hoax and is blasphemy.

The Word of God is what it is...there are no secret messages, and nothing hidden within. But this is getting off topic.

I thought for a long time that she was, but then it was pointed out to me that even though Lazurus had a sister named Mary, they lived in the city of Bethany, while Mary Magdalene means Mary of Magdala. I wondered if Magdala could have been where she was born, but she later lived in Bethany (when Jesus was ministering)...but then would Jesus have been called Jesus of Bethlehem instead of Jesus of Nazareth, since He was born in Bethlehem but raised in Nazareth? If Mary Magdalene was also Mary the sister of Lazarus, then she was the one who anointed Jesus' feet in Simon the Leper's house. But if these were two different Marys, then I've been wrong for a long time! I know it's not that big of an issue (unless it can help break the DaVinci myth), but what do you guys think?

I have wondered a few of these things myself. I am still conducting my own research into the matter...but from what I have read in published journals, there are MANY conflicting views.

[Jonathan]

I think she meant that she was going to expose some of the 'facts' presented in the book for what they really are in the appropriate thread in the Town Hall.

[Blipadouzi]

I think she meant that she was going to expose some of the 'facts' presented in the book for what they really are in the appropriate thread in the Town Hall.

Oh ya....I knew that...

[COWBOY OF TEXAS]

I've always thought that they are two different people, there were a lot of Mary's back then.



-Cowboy

[Jennifer Doyle]

There was Mary who was the sister of Lazerus and Mary the former prostitute and demon possesed woman . . .

[Blipadouzi]

Mary Magdalene, i.e., Mary of Magdala, a town on the western shore of the Lake of Tiberias. She is for the first time noticed in Luke 8:3 as one of the women who "ministered to Christ of their substance." Their motive was that of gratitude for deliverances he had wrought for them. Out of Mary were cast seven demons. Gratitude to her great Deliverer prompted her to become his follower. These women accompanied him also on his last journey to Jerusalem (Matt. 27:55; Mark 15:41; Luke 23:55). They stood near the cross. There Mary remained till all was over, and the body was taken down and laid in Joseph's tomb.

Again, in the earliest dawn of the first day of the week she, with Salome and Mary the mother of James (Matt. 28:1; Mark 16:2), came to the sepulchre [tomb], bringing with them sweet spices, that they might anoint the body of Jesus. They found the sepulchre empty, but saw the "vision of angels" (Matt. 28:5). She hastens to tell Peter and John, who were probably living together at this time (John 20:1,2), and again immediately returns to the sepulchre. There she lingers thoughtfully, weeping at the door of the tomb. The risen Lord appears to her, but at first she knows him not. His utterance of her name "Mary" recalls her to consciousness, and she utters the joyful, reverent cry, "Rabboni." She would fain cling to him, but he forbids her, saying, "Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father." This is the last record regarding Mary of Magdala, who now returned to Jerusalem.

The idea that this Mary was "the woman who was a sinner," or that she was unchaste, is altogether groundless.

******************************

Mary the sister of Lazarus is brought to our notice in connection with the visits of our Lord to Bethany. She is contrasted with her sister Martha, who was "cumbered about many things" while Jesus was their guest, while Mary had chosen "the good part." Her character also appears in connection with the death of her brother (John 11:20, 31,33). On the occasion of our Lord's last visit to Bethany, Mary brought "a pound of ointment of spikenard, very costly, and anointed the feet of Jesus" as he reclined at table in the house of one Simon, who had been a leper (Matt. 26:6; Mark 14:3; John 12:2,3). This was an evidence of her overflowing love to the Lord. Nothing is known of her subsequent history. It would appear from this act of Mary's, and from the circumstance that they possessed a family vault (11:38), and that a large number of Jews from Jerusalem came to condole with them on the death of Lazarus (11:19), that this family at Bethany belonged to the wealthier class of the people.

[Jeremy]

Yeah, they're not the same person.

Also, neither Mary is the "sinner" who anointed Jesus' feet at Simon the Pharisee's house.

Jeremy

[Chandler]

I don't think they're the same person because there's no obvious connection and Mary/Miriam was a common name back then.

[totustuus]

there seem to be a dozen Marys that followed Jesus around (who was it? Mary the wife of Clophas and Mary of Magdala and Mary the mother of who was it? and the "other Mary" not to mention, Mary Jesus's mother. ) However, I think it is accepted by many (though not taught) that Mary Magdelene was the sinner who bathed Jesus's feet with perfume

[Blipadouzi]

However, I think it is accepted by many (though not taught) that Mary Magdelene was the sinner who bathed Jesus's feet with perfume

This is finem and I would be ready to agree...but where is the scripture to back up this "teaching"?

[Jeremy]

Here is Luke's account, starting with the sinner who anointed Jesus' feet:

And He said to the woman, "Your faith has saved you; go in peace."
1Soon afterwards, He began going around from one city and village to another, proclaiming and preaching the kingdom of God. The twelve were with Him,
2and also some women who had been healed of evil spirits and sicknesses: Mary who was called Magdalene, from whom seven demons had gone out,
3and Joanna the wife of Chuza, Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others who were contributing to their support out of their private means." (Luke 7:50-8:3 NASB.)

It just doesn't sound to me like it's the same woman.

Jeremy

[Arwen]

I don't think Mary Magdalene is the same as Mary of Bethany. I'm not sure which Mary washed Jesus' feet.

[Blipadouzi]

Ok...here are the 4 scripture references that has caused all this confusion...(All scripture is taken from the NIV, except where indicated.)

Matthew 26:

(6)While Jesus was in Bethany in the home of a man known as Simon the Leper, (7)a woman came to him with an alabaster jar of very expensive perfume, which she poured on his head as he was reclining at the table.

(8)When the disciples saw this, they were indignant. "Why this waste?" they asked. (9)"This perfume could have been sold at a high price and the money given to the poor."

(10)Aware of this, Jesus said to them, "Why are you bothering this woman? She has done a beautiful thing to me. (11)The poor you will always have with you, but you will not always have me. (12)When she poured this perfume on my body, she did it to prepare me for burial. (13)I tell you the truth, wherever this gospel is preached throughout the world, what she has done will also be told, in memory of her."


Mark 14:

(1)Now the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread were only two days away, and the chief priests and the teachers of the law were looking for some sly way to arrest Jesus and kill him. (2)"But not during the Feast," they said, "or the people may riot."

(3)While he was in Bethany, reclining at the table in the home of a man known as Simon the Leper, a woman came with an alabaster jar of very expensive perfume, made of pure nard. She broke the jar and poured the perfume on his head.

(4)Some of those present were saying indignantly to one another, "Why this waste of perfume? (5)It could have been sold for more than a year's wages and the money given to the poor." And they rebuked her harshly.

(6)"Leave her alone," said Jesus. "Why are you bothering her? She has done a beautiful thing to me. (7)The poor you will always have with you, and you can help them any time you want. But you will not always have me. (8)She did what she could. She poured perfume on my body beforehand to prepare for my burial. (9)I tell you the truth, wherever the gospel is preached throughout the world, what she has done will also be told, in memory of her."

(10)Then Judas Iscariot, one of the Twelve, went to the chief priests to betray Jesus to them. (11)They were delighted to hear this and promised to give him money. So he watched for an opportunity to hand him over.


Luke 7:

(36)Now one of the Pharisees invited Jesus to have dinner with him, so he went to the Pharisee's house and reclined at the table. (37)When a woman who had lived a sinful life in that town learned that Jesus was eating at the Pharisee's house, she brought an alabaster jar of perfume, (38)and as she stood behind him at his feet weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears. Then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them and poured perfume on them.

(39)When the Pharisee who had invited him saw this, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, he would know who is touching him and what kind of woman she is—that she is a sinner."

(40)Jesus answered him, "Simon, I have something to tell you."
"Tell me, teacher," he said.

(41)"Two men owed money to a certain moneylender. One owed him five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. (42)Neither of them had the money to pay him back, so he canceled the debts of both. Now which of them will love him more?"

(43)Simon replied, "I suppose the one who had the bigger debt canceled."
"You have judged correctly," Jesus said.

(44)Then he turned toward the woman and said to Simon, "Do you see this woman? I came into your house. You did not give me any water for my feet, but she wet my feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. (45)You did not give me a kiss, but this woman, from the time I entered, has not stopped kissing my feet. (46)You did not put oil on my head, but she has poured perfume on my feet. (47)Therefore, I tell you, her many sins have been forgiven—for she loved much. But he who has been forgiven little loves little."

(48)Then Jesus said to her, "Your sins are forgiven."

(49)The other guests began to say among themselves, "Who is this who even forgives sins?"

(50)Jesus said to the woman, "Your faith has saved you; go in peace."


John 12:

(1)Six days before the Passover, Jesus arrived at Bethany, where Lazarus lived, whom Jesus had raised from the dead. (2)Here a dinner was given in Jesus' honor. Martha served, while Lazarus was among those reclining at the table with him. (3)Then Mary took about a pint of pure nard, an expensive perfume; she poured it on Jesus' feet and wiped his feet with her hair. And the house was filled with the fragrance of the perfume.

(4)But one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, who was later to betray him, objected, (5)"Why wasn't this perfume sold and the money given to the poor? It was worth a year's wages." (6)He did not say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief; as keeper of the money bag, he used to help himself to what was put into it.

(7)"Leave her alone," Jesus replied. " It was intended that she should save this perfume for the day of my burial. (8)You will always have the poor among you, but you will not always have me."

(9)Meanwhile a large crowd of Jews found out that Jesus was there and came, not only because of him but also to see Lazarus, whom he had raised from the dead. (10)So the chief priests made plans to kill Lazarus as well, (11)for on account of him many of the Jews were going over to Jesus and putting their faith in him.

Now, Matthew, Mark & John pretty much tell the same story...with some minor differences. John says is was Lazarus' house while Matthew and Mark say it was Simon the Leper's house. It is believed that Simon the Leper and Lazarus were business partners, and so it is very conceiveable that they shared a house.

But this is an assumption, and we will not make any assumptions...

All 3 state that the house was in Bethany, all 3 show a woman (named Mary by John)...but the most important of all, all 3 show Jesus rebuking the disciples and Judas in particular...

While Luke shows a woman known to be a sinner (but who isn't) to come into the house of Simon, a Pharisee...and here, Jesus rebuke's Simon.

So even though Mary of Bethany is a sinner, simply by being human...we can not conclude that she is the sinful woman that came to see Jesus at Simon the Pharisee's house.

Furthermore, nothing here indicates Mary of Magdala. And although John simply calls our Passover woman "Mary" and nothing more, as they are discussing the events in Bethany, and he names the activities of Martha & Lazarus is succession...it is safe to say that the Mary mentioned here is the sister of Lazarus.

[totustuus]

However, I think it is accepted by many (though not taught) that Mary Magdelene was the sinner who bathed Jesus's feet with perfume

This is finem and I would be ready to agree...but where is the scripture to back up this "teaching"?

It's not a "teaching" and I'm pretty sure there's absolutely no scripture to back it up. I'm not even sure if I believe that she is the same woman. It doesn't really make much sense. The Bible tends to make it pretty clear who people are, such as referring to Simon as the father of this guy and this other guy (Sorry, I'm too lasy to go look up a bible verse right now.)

[ichthuz]

this topic is pointless. why worry about it? it just seems like playin near the edge to me

[The Artful Dodger]

I don't really think that they are the same person, but it doesn't really matter. I'd rather focus on Jesus than all of the Mary's who followed Him. And I would be dissapointed if an argument started, because this isn't a big issue.

[Arwen]

It's not a really big issue, but it's interesting to think about.

[Kris Doyle]

Yeah, I hope no one thought I was trying to start an argument. It was just something I'd been wondering about. Thanks for all the explanations, everyone. God bless!

--Kris Doyle