So. Homeschool.

[American Eagle]

. There were multiple tests that both Homeschoolers and Regular Schoolers took, and Homeschoolers were generally smarter.

The only way for the test to be legit is if we get the smartest kids from homeschoolers and regular schoolers. Because if you just test all the kids from public schools, of course they're going to score lower due to population wise.

Actually, I think the best way to do it would be to take like 10,000 kids from both types of schools and average out their scores. If you only took the smartest kid(s) from each system, it's likely that you'd find more super geniuses from the public schools because there's so many more kids in it. It wouldn't be fair to us hometeached.

[The Top Crusader]

Taking ALL public schoolers into account though isn't really fair because some of them just don't care and fail everything... that isn't really the educator's fault. I'm sure in most cases where there is a kid getting zero on everything there are other kids who actually try and pay attention who do great.

[ric]

And of course there's unschoolers.

[EK]

School isn't where I learned half of my knowledge anyway. The majority of what I learned throughout my life has been self-researched and self-taught...and I'm guessing this is the same for alot people, so testing people to determine if their schooling made them smarter is kind of redundant.

The art of self motivation is a beautiful thing, and as necessary you may think it is in homeschool, it's equally if not more necessary in public school. Especially in inner city schools where the teachers get paid darn near minimum wage and have a bunch of hoodlums to deal with.

The only advantage going to a school with people in it has it that you can have friends that you automatically get to hang out with everyday, kind of like when you have a job or you're in college.

[Whitty Whit]

lol My first disciplinary action as Mayor! *laughs at above censored post*

Yeah, EK, the last part of your post I agree with. That's the main, if not only, reason I don't like being homeschooled. Don't get me wrong, I love hanging out with people. I just don't do it as much as other people do who go to school.

[EK]

Stupid auto-censors. THIS IS AMERICA! ...kind of.

But yeah that's the thing about high schools with people in them. I had my three bros and various other people that I always hung out with everyday, didn't really have to call them or plan to hang out...we just went to school, it was assured one of us had a car so during our break from classes we could all just hop in and ride off like we were never there. Whereas when you're in homeschool...you can always get on AIM or Facebook or whatever and slack off and talk to people but it's alot lamer.

[jelly]

I've remained unengaged in this topic for too long.

Yes, I exaggerated. I'm pretty sure most of us on this board won't hold it against parents if they don't let their 12 year-old children watch Saw. But what about PG-13 movies, secular music...any music with drums for that matter? How can any of that help you practically to survive in life, not to mention spiritually? Coldplay has tons of positive messages in their music, yes...but is there anything you can't get from reading the Bible for heaven's sake?

This, I believe, is the utter naivety of the home school'd culture. It's one thing for you to shelter your children from pop culture while they're young, it's another thing to stubbornly hold to a mindset that anything outside of the Bible is harmful/unnecessary for your spiritual life. What are you going to do, lock yourself away with a copy of the Bible and live a perfect existence? The Bible itself is only relevant in light of the culture it's surrounded in. It's not a magical book.. it'll only speak to you in relevant ways if the Spirit speaks to you through it. And I know firsthand that the Spirit speaks to people through all types of media/literature/culture. Some of my most memorable moments of divine experience have come through watching 'secular' films such as Donnie Darko, Seven, Memento and Pulp Fiction. Such ambiguous art is designed specifically to trigger something inside of you; to tug at questions deep within your soul. The greatest and best of Hollywood films don't shove your mind full of useless garbage at all... they simply ask questions through the relevant medium of art, leaving you to discover new revelations through your relationship with the Spirit. The same thing goes for music. I believe it's essential to not only understand, but to commit yourself to this mindset... it's not only a requirement for relating to people who exist outside your protective bubble, but it's a commandment of Jesus Christ to go out into the world with the truth of the gospel. And you won't achieve that by handing people Bibles. You achieve that through mediums such as film and music -- and not merely explicitly Christian attempts such as Fireproof or Courageous, but through ways that people will relate.

That was somewhat of a tangent, but i hope I got my point across. For years I always wondered what it was about homeschooling/sheltering that seemed so wrong to me, and I've learned to discover that this it. Also, QFT the entirety of Sarai's conclusion.

[ric]

I've remained unengaged in this topic for too long.

Yes, I exaggerated. I'm pretty sure most of us on this board won't hold it against parents if they don't let their 12 year-old children watch Saw. But what about PG-13 movies, secular music...any music with drums for that matter? How can any of that help you practically to survive in life, not to mention spiritually? Coldplay has tons of positive messages in their music, yes...but is there anything you can't get from reading the Bible for heaven's sake?

This, I believe, is the utter naivety of the home school'd culture. It's one thing for you to shelter your children from pop culture while they're young, it's another thing to stubbornly hold to a mindset that anything outside of the Bible is harmful/unnecessary for your spiritual life. What are you going to do, lock yourself away with a copy of the Bible and live a perfect existence? The Bible itself is only relevant in light of the culture it's surrounded in. It's not a magical book.. it'll only speak to you in relevant ways if the Spirit speaks to you through it. And I know firsthand that the Spirit speaks to people through all types of media/literature/culture. Some of my most memorable moments of divine experience have come through watching 'secular' films such as Donnie Darko, Seven, Memento and Pulp Fiction. Such ambiguous art is designed specifically to trigger something inside of you; to tug at questions deep within your soul. The greatest and best of Hollywood films don't shove your mind full of useless garbage at all... they simply ask questions through the relevant medium of art, leaving you to discover new revelations through your relationship with the Spirit. The same thing goes for music. I believe it's essential to not only understand, but to commit yourself to this mindset... it's not only a requirement for relating to people who exist outside your protective bubble, but it's a commandment of Jesus Christ to go out into the world with the truth of the gospel. And you won't achieve that by handing people Bibles. You achieve that through mediums such as film and music -- and not merely explicitly Christian attempts such as Fireproof or Courageous, but through ways that people will relate.

That was somewhat of a tangent, but i hope I got my point across. For years I always wondered what it was about homeschooling/sheltering that seemed so wrong to me, and I've learned to discover that this it. Also, QFT the entirety of Sarai's conclusion.

I get your point, and I agree with it to some extent. Some people are called to learn about secular entertainment and feel that you can learn much through it. I personally believe that there are limited but nonetheless meaningful positives to secular media.

But I also think you overestimate their importance. I'm 100% sure any message you can get from secular films or books you can get from Christian films or books, minus all the language and undesirable content. (Okay, maybe not the films thing; Christian films are pretty terrible.) And some people feel called to follow Psalm 101:3 to the letter - and the fact is, it's hard to find a secular media source that doesn't have some 'evil' or at least undesirable parts. Case and point, Mumford & Sons. This is a band I've recently fallen in love with. They have amazing messages about love, God, heaven, etc, all while being very popular in secular media. However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad. Yes, there is some good in the secular world, but it's hard to find where it hasn't been tainted by the Fall. Does that mean it's right to just hide yourself from the world with your Bible? No. And in that area I think we agree more than you think, and perhaps I'm not as naive as you think. However, I disagree with the overwhelming criticism of parents who try to filter what their children take in. If someone believes that television is inherently evil, and they act on that by never watching tv, more power to them. My point is, that child who lived his whole life without a tv can have every bit as strong a relationship with God and people as someone who lived their whole life with a tv.

The criticism of sheltering often isn't being critical of parents who don't allow their children to encounter secular media; it's often criticizing the parents inability to teach their children themselves. And yes, that is wrong, I agree completely. But try to get straight what it is exactly that you're criticizing.

[jelly]

I get your point, and I agree with it to some extent. Some people are called to learn about secular entertainment and feel that you can learn much through it. I personally believe that there are limited but nonetheless meaningful positives to secular media.

But I also think you overestimate their importance.

Yeah.. I tend to make my conclusions based on what I know to be true for me on a personal level. For me, the importance of films was not at all exaggerated, because that's where my passion lies. I do not suggest that to be true for everyone.

And some people feel called to follow Psalm 101:3 to the letter - and the fact is, it's hard to find a secular media source that doesn't have some 'evil' or at least undesirable parts. Case and point, Mumford & Sons. This is a band I've recently fallen in love with. They have amazing messages about love, God, heaven, etc, all while being very popular in secular media. However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad. Yes, there is some good in the secular world, but it's hard to find where it hasn't been tainted by the Fall.

You're mostly right.. but let me jump on your example. What exactly is wrong with the f-word? Does its existence blaspheme God in any way? It's a word that our culture has regarded as impolite... that's about it. I'm not condoning a regular use of foul language, but I fully believe it's fully appropriate in many instances, especially in music or film. I don't usually go around dropping f-bombs because it doesn't exactly suit my personality (;)), however I've stumbled upon instances in working with screenplays where it's simply not productive or necessary to censor harsh language.

My point is that you shouldn't be so quick to let things such as violence, sex and language instantly repulse you from what could potentially be a fully relevant and inspired message. I mean, the Bible features all manner of explicit content quite extensively, and it certainly doesn't always make the effort to point out all the morals in an explicit fashion.

Does that mean it's right to just hide yourself from the world with your Bible? No. And in that area I think we agree more than you think, and perhaps I'm not as naive as you think. However, I disagree with the overwhelming criticism of parents who try to filter what their children take in. If someone believes that television is inherently evil, and they act on that by never watching tv, more power to them. My point is, that child who lived his whole life without a tv can have every bit as strong a relationship with God and people as someone who lived their whole life with a tv.

Well I certainly hope you didn't take offense, but keep in mind that I'm not sitting here criticizing as an outsider who thinks homeschooling is dumb. I've lived the fully sheltered life, and I can totally see myself in many of the hyper-conservative, sheltered kids whom I now enjoy challenging. I look back at all the opinionated posts I made back when I was fairly ignorant of the world, and shake my head with the realization that I was simply an idiot. I disagree with the notion that someone who lives their life avoiding media will have just as strong of a spiritual faith then that of someone who is seeking to fulfill the Great Commission by embracing culture with the mindset that Jesus would possess.

The criticism of sheltering often isn't being critical of parents who don't allow their children to encounter secular media; it's often criticizing the parents inability to teach their children themselves. And yes, that is wrong, I agree completely. But try to get straight what it is exactly that you're criticizing.

Your parents teach you how to live up until a point. After that, you need to start growing on your own. And I don't mean when you're 18... I mean as soon as you mature to a point of discerning for yourself how to define your own worldview. The internet taught me far more then my parents ever did, in terms of knowledge. Ultimately, I would be a hopeless mess without my parent's spiritual guidance in my life, but their role was never to shelter me from things I was meant to discover and deal with on my own.

The best 'field trip' my dad ever took me on was when I went to see Spiderman 2 back when I was twelve. He sat me down afterwords and asked me exactly what it communicated through its story, and what morals I could take away from it. The rest is history.

[ric]

And some people feel called to follow Psalm 101:3 to the letter - and the fact is, it's hard to find a secular media source that doesn't have some 'evil' or at least undesirable parts. Case and point, Mumford & Sons. This is a band I've recently fallen in love with. They have amazing messages about love, God, heaven, etc, all while being very popular in secular media. However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad. Yes, there is some good in the secular world, but it's hard to find where it hasn't been tainted by the Fall.

You're mostly right.. but let me jump on your example. What exactly is wrong with the f-word? Does its existence blaspheme God in any way? It's a word that our culture has regarded as impolite... that's about it. I'm not condoning a regular use of foul language, but I fully believe it's fully appropriate in many instances, especially in music or film. I don't usually go around dropping f-bombs because it doesn't exactly suit my personality (;)), however I've stumbled upon instances in working with screenplays where it's simply not productive or necessary to censor harsh language.

My point is that you shouldn't be so quick to let things such as violence, sex and language instantly repulse you from what could potentially be a fully relevant and inspired message. I mean, the Bible features all manner of explicit content quite extensively, and it certainly doesn't always make the effort to point out all the morals in an explicit fashion.

I have often thought about this myself. The particular instance does not blaspheme God or people, but it's a cultural taboo. Even the band's record label was pushing them to use a different word. And when the secular media starts worrying about language, you know something's up. How do you think an atheist who thinks bad language is generally impolite is going to respond to a Christian spouting off bad language, even in music?

Yes, and my point is people shouldn't be so quick to say "Ya, so there was sex, language, drugs, etc, but it still had a lot of good, meaningful messages."

Does that mean it's right to just hide yourself from the world with your Bible? No. And in that area I think we agree more than you think, and perhaps I'm not as naive as you think. However, I disagree with the overwhelming criticism of parents who try to filter what their children take in. If someone believes that television is inherently evil, and they act on that by never watching tv, more power to them. My point is, that child who lived his whole life without a tv can have every bit as strong a relationship with God and people as someone who lived their whole life with a tv.

Well I certainly hope you didn't take offense, but keep in mind that I'm not sitting here criticizing as an outsider who thinks homeschooling is dumb. I've lived the fully sheltered life, and I can totally see myself in many of the hyper-conservative, sheltered kids whom I now enjoy challenging. I look back at all the opinionated posts I made back when I was fairly ignorant of the world, and shake my head with the realization that I was simply an idiot. I disagree with the notion that someone who lives their life avoiding media will have just as strong of a spiritual faith then that of someone who is seeking to fulfill the Great Commission by embracing culture with the mindset that Jesus would possess.

Embracing culture? Lol...that's the last thing Jesus did... He embraced the people, not their culture. These are two completely different things. But, to some extent, yes, it does require a knowledge of people and their interests in order to embrace them. I just think the importance of television is largely exaggerated. It seems to me when you speak of ignorance, you're speaking of world issues, not entertainment. And honestly, how many kids watch the news?

[jelly]

I have often thought about this myself. The particular instance does not blaspheme God or people, but it's a cultural taboo. Even the band's record label was pushing them to use a different word. And when the secular media starts worrying about language, you know something's up. How do you think an atheist who thinks bad language is generally impolite is going to respond to a Christian spouting off bad language, even in music?

Yes, and my point is people shouldn't be so quick to say "Ya, so there was sex, language, drugs, etc, but it still had a lot of good, meaningful messages."

You're misunderstanding me. I'm not attempting to excuse strong language.. I'm implying that it has its place. In a passionate, climactic moment on film, a specific character may be very much required to use the strong language that suits his role. It would be an unnecessary mistake to try and censor him. I believe that the band you're referring to made various attempts to substitute the language, but they decided in the end that nothing else flowed in the same way and they didn't want to sacrifice the music merely for the sake of appeasing some cultural taboo.

To say that would be missing the point. I don't watch films that promote violence or sex merely for the sake of violence and sex. I'm speaking of films in which the strong, powerful message can only be accessed by taking a journey through dark and 'worldly' places. This is exactly what we need to see more of from Christian filmmakers.

Embracing culture? Lol...that's the last thing Jesus did... He embraced the people, not their culture. These are two completely different things. But, to some extent, yes, it does require a knowledge of people and their interests in order to embrace them. I just think the importance of television is largely exaggerated. It seems to me when you speak of ignorance, you're speaking of world issues, not entertainment. And honestly, how many kids watch the news?

He embraced people through their culture. He met people exactly where they were at; on the streets, at the tax collection booths, etc. And in many ways, they are actually interconnected. You can't just walk up to any random person with a complete disdain for popular culture with the intent of connecting with them. And no, I do mean entertainment. Far more relevant to kids then the news is. But, big picture, why should you choose to remain ignorant in any area?

[Angel]

My background: My dad served in the military, and our only practical option was to be homeschooled. I came to America when I was about 9 years old, so I could have switched to public school then, but we had decided that the best way to learn what my parents believed to be true was to continue the homeschooling.

My parents didn't watch tv at home (we didn't care to pay for cable, we didn't care to sit through commercials and waste time). But I was allowed to go to friends' houses for a certain amount of time and watch movies/tv there, with prior permission. In regards to worldview and the secular world (or "sheltering", however you wish to explain it), I believe it is important to have the knowledge of what is going on in the world, but not be a part of it. If I ever had a question about what a word meant, or why people did what they did, my parents would be willing to explain the reasoning to the best of their ability, and if they disagreed with what was happening in music or in movies, they would explain why and back it up with a biblical principal.

It's also important to understand that at the moment, I do not listen to music and watch tv very frequently, and at this point I go to college where there are people with a great variety of backgrounds. I never swear, and my parents taught me never to swear, or watch anything inappropriate. But they did teach me about the theories of evolution and what people believe about it so that I would know what it meant. I do consider myself socialized. I was part of a speech and debate league every year of my high school education, and I met people from all over the country (US). But just to settle a misunderstanding, it doesn't always matter the quantity of socialization, some people who spend hours and hours with people all the time still don't know how to act around others. People are just different, period. It's not always a matter of what schooling you had, it's about how you reacted to the schooling you had. I attended a community college in my last year of highschool, and I was able to see what cussing, drug-abusing, crazy teens/adults were like. I also have a Catholic friend in college now who grew up going to public school, and she's turned out just fine. But it doesn't really matter how many personal examples I bring up, the point is: Please don't use absolutes when we're talking about schooling kids. Public school doesn't always work. Private school doesn't always work. Christian school doesn't always work. Home school doesn't always work. School doesn't always work. And vice versa.

That being said, I'm going to reply to some of the posts:

And you guys who are saying that evolution was shoved down your throats in public school, it really depends on which professor or teacher you have. I had a good one who told us that we wasn't teaching evolution to convert us, but to to have enough knowledge of it to make our own conclusion.

This is a good method of teaching. Not to impose opinions on the student, but to present information according to the principle at hand, and then allow the student to form their own ideas based off of the information given.

He embraced people through their culture. He met people exactly where they were at; on the streets, at the tax collection booths, etc. And in many ways, they are actually interconnected. You can't just walk up to any random person with a complete disdain for popular culture with the intent of connecting with them. And no, I do mean entertainment. Far more relevant to kids then the news is. But, big picture, why should you choose to remain ignorant in any area?

The big difference is, He loved the sinner, and hated the sin. He did not go around stealing other peoples' money because that's what the tax collectors were doing. I personally have watched a few tv shows that I wouldn't on a regular basis (e.g. Dead Like Me, House, The Office) and read books (like Twilight) that I don't necessarily support, in order to understand peoples' perspective on that part of media, and possibly understand their reason for attraction to it. But, there is a huge difference between being educated on the content of a book, movie, tv show, album, theory, etc. and actually taking part in it and acting according to what you see/hear. It is a great testimony to others when you can explain the content of these things, but not act out according to what is not glorifying God. (for example, Dead Like Me contains the f-word a lot, and as I watched some of the episodes, it was constantly in my mind, but I stopped watching it so that my mind could be focused on Christ more, and not be tempted to speak like that)
The underlying issue, however, is: How do you want to be seen? If you aren't effected by what is in a tv show, or what they teach in public schools, that's fine, but it's when you start acting in a way that is not pleasing to God that others notice. And in order to be a good witness, do you really want others to see a Christian watching a movie with a bunch of sex and cussing in it?

My future: Even though I've been homeschooled, I do plan on teaching in an Elementary school. I also plan to homeschool my kids. If you think that's hypocritical, I don't believe it is, I am just trying to give God glory by teaching children and instructing them to learn more.

[Oba-rai]

Yes, I know lack of social skills could lead to other things, but if someone is schooled using Christian curriculum and has a strong foundation, hopefully once they're introduced into the "real world" they'll know how to handle it.

When will this be? When they're 18 and finally going off to actually interact with people who are not Christians? When they're 23 and getting married?

If you weren't allowed to interact with non-Christians until you were 18...I'm sorry, that's just sad. But really, I have never seen this at all. Pretty much all the homeschoolers I know were involved in some sort of outside-the-home activity with non-Christians, be it sports, debate, drama, whatever. Of course, I mostly know former-homeschoolers, so I can't speak to the ones who homeschool through high school.
Also, many homeschoolers start attending private or public school once in high school, which is mainly what I was referring to.

I was allowed to interact with non-Christians before 18, but the general attitude surrounding interaction with them was that the only intention for interaction was conversion. The "before 18" thing wasn't a commentary on myself, but on other people I know and have seen.

Also, about the sheltered thing, the only way I see homeschoolers being sheltered is entertainment-wise. And have we really sunk so far as to think someone can't survive in the real world if they haven't seen the latest Saw movie, or heard the latest profanity-ridden rap record? Really?

IS THIS THE REAL LIFE.
OR IS THIS FANTASY.
CAUGHT IN A LANDSLIDE.
NO ESCAPE FROM REALITY.

Lawl @ "Saw" and "profanity-ridden rap record." Is that what people on here really think about pop culture? How about "Inception" or K'naan? Snow Patrol? Anyway. Entertainment affects everything for many people these days. It's the way people connect -- shared experiences, shared interests, et cetera. Just as you'd hope people connect over favourite books, favourite inspirational figures, favourite cars, or sports, people connect through their experience of entertainment. Going to a Taylor Swift concert. Listening to Coldplay on your way back from school. Watching Bones or NCIS on TV.

I went from "oh my gawsh entertainment" to where I am now. I don't like the Saw movies. I don't seek out music that is offensive to my values and stuff. But I watch TV regularly (lulz Food Channel), go to a public state university, see movies regularly, and laugh at hipsters. And I certainly don't run screaming in shock whenever someone implies I was sheltered by my homeschooling. I was. It was a negative thing, but made me incredibly more smart than most people my age, so you have to take the good with the bad.

Yes, I exaggerated. I'm pretty sure most of us on this board won't hold it against parents if they don't let their 12 year-old children watch Saw. But what about PG-13 movies, secular music...any music with drums for that matter? How can any of that help you practically to survive in life, not to mention spiritually? Coldplay has tons of positive messages in their music, yes...but is there anything you can't get from reading the Bible for heaven's sake? That's why I get mad when people talk about sheltering like it's some sort of sacrilege. Ya, it's very bad if you're just locked in your room, never hearing about politics, or social issues, or other religions, but do any of you really know anyone like that?

Yes. Yes I do. I went to a church this summer where the only mention of pop culture was to tell everyone how much of an abomination it was. And music with drums! Don't get me started on the evils of music with drums.

I do agree that it takes some knowledge of the world and maybe even pop culture to form relationships with people, but not that much. I've made friends over the years with non-Christians who are like, "You haven't seen Blah blah? Man, you're sheltered," and then move on. It really isn't that big of a deal. You can still make friends with people who have different interests, or morals for that matter.

I think it's mostly just a stereotype. Ya, there were super-sheltered kids a long time ago, but we're in the 21st century now. I'd be willing to bet it's a lot less common nowadays.

Not really. With the advent of the Internet's availability, sure, kids can certainly "get out there" a bit more, but if they're still at home and interfacing with the attitudes of their parents (if they are indeed being sheltered) they're still going to adopt much of those ideas. Until something big breaks in and they rethink the nature of their beliefs.

This, I believe, is the utter naivety of the home school'd culture. It's one thing for you to shelter your children from pop culture while they're young, it's another thing to stubbornly hold to a mindset that anything outside of the Bible is harmful/unnecessary for your spiritual life.

QFT.

However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad.

No, what's sad is that one would react to that word as if it's a blasphemy, and consider that a tarnish on an awesome musical group.

Derp.

[Sherlock]

Wow people are, like, all fired up about this.

Anywho, I was a homeschooled kid for basically all of my formative years up to about age 16 when I started going to the community college for free, state-subsidised college credits (yay). So you're getting my 20s-something perspective on this after having been out of the scene for a while.

So basically, during different parts of my life, I've had different opinions about homeschooling, verging between the two poles of it being the most awesome educational option ever to being socially damaging. Currently, I can sort of see both arguments and the way I sort of parse it out at this point is that I don't really have a problem with homeschooling younger kids. In fact, I'd argue that it might be better due to increased time with parents which I think is pretty important when you're really young. Another thing I liked about homeschooling was that I was never isolated into my peer group, and at a very young age I learned how to comfortably interact with adults.

Now for the negatives. When I got older, say, junior highish and high school age, I was in a bit of a predicament because most of my friends were homeschooled from the local, Evangelical homeschool group who believed in strict dress codes, no secular music and absolutely no interaction with non-Christians. The problem is that my family didn't necessarily believe these things, so I was allowed to interact with the neighbor kids and all that, which created a big tension between the "homeschool" atmosphere, and the "real world" (for lack of a better term). I quickly learned what jokes, references and entertainment were appropriate for one group and not the other and what things I should and shouldn't say to make me sound like a total prude. That said, there was a period of, um... adjustment in which I was pretty much the social outcast with the public school kids.

I guess the bottom line is that, if I were able to do it all over again and choose, I probably would have stuck with homeschooling during grade school as the education I got was really excellent, I progressed at my own pace, was able to skip grades and have a lot of free time for fun, kid stuff. However, for High School, I really wish I would have had the opportunity to have that experience, as I think a lot of people carry High School friends throughout life. I'm not psychologically scarred or anything from lacking the experience, but it does affect how I relate to my peers to this day. Also, not being exposed to pop culture for most of my childhood meant that I had to do a lot of "catch up" for a few years after junior high, just learning references, music, TV etc. We didn't have a TV in the house, and obviously no internet at that time, so I had no idea what public school kids my age listened to or did. It took a while to learn, and I think I was honestly well into college before I felt truly comfortable interacting with peers who hadn't been homeschooled (and, even then, most of them were still of some variety of Christian).

So, I guess any educational choice has good and bad qualities. I favor a mixed approach, but it really varies for everyone, these were just my experiences with it.

[Whitty Whit]

However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad.

No, what's sad is that one would react to that word as if it's a blasphemy, and consider that a tarnish on an awesome musical group.

Derp.

lol. The Bible says to (paraphrasing) "do not let corrupt communication come out of thy mouth". I believe a swear word is constituted as corrupt communication...

[Angel]

However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad.

No, what's sad is that one would react to that word as if it's a blasphemy, and consider that a tarnish on an awesome musical group.

Derp.

lol. The Bible says to (paraphrasing) "do not let corrupt communication come out of thy mouth". I believe a swear word is constituted as corrupt communication...

Ephesians 4:29
"Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers."

As I mentioned before, some of the things that you see/hear don't really affect you that much, but it's important 1. to watch for when you start thinking about those things on a regular basis, because then it really does turn into corruption, especially if you act out upon it. 2. to make sure you are not causing weaker brothers in the faith, or non-believers to stumble because of what you watch/listen to.
In my opinion, if a song keeps using cuss words, I'm not going to listen to it. I've been able to communicate and get to know people of other religions by talking with them about shows that use bad words, and I was certainly allowed to talk and interact with non-Christians, but the testimony is how we live our lives.

[ric]

I went to a church this summer where the only mention of pop culture was to tell everyone how much of an abomination it was. And music with drums! Don't get me started on the evils of music with drums.

I don't believe music with drums is evil. This is merely a stance held by some sheltering families that I don't believe is entirely sinful.

However, one song repeatedly uses the f-word. It's just sad.

No, what's sad is that one would react to that word as if it's a blasphemy, and consider that a tarnish on an awesome musical group.

Derp.

Did I say it was blasphemy? No. Did I say I think the band is sinful and that they're not Christians? No. Let's not twist words.

I merely do not like the f-word because I don't think it's a nice word, and I don't like hearing it in my music.

In my opinion, if a song keeps using cuss words, I'm not going to listen to it. I've been able to communicate and get to know people of other religions by talking with them about shows that use bad words, and I was certainly allowed to talk and interact with non-Christians, but the testimony is how we live our lives.

QFT.

[Whitty Whit]

I went to a church this summer where the only mention of pop culture was to tell everyone how much of an abomination it was. And music with drums! Don't get me started on the evils of music with drums.

I don't believe music with drums is evil. This is merely a stance held by some sheltering families that I don't believe is entirely sinful.

Just somewhat sinful, eh, ric? Oh great, now we can be for God in one aspect, but against Him in another. And I'm just teasing you, ric, on the way you worded that.

[ric]

I went to a church this summer where the only mention of pop culture was to tell everyone how much of an abomination it was. And music with drums! Don't get me started on the evils of music with drums.

I don't believe music with drums is evil. This is merely a stance held by some sheltering families that I don't believe is entirely sinful.

Just somewhat sinful, eh, ric? Oh great, now we can be for God in one aspect, but against Him in another. And I'm just teasing you, ric, on the way you worded that.

lol...okay, not sinful at all, although possibly slightly maybe just a little bit out of it.

But I don't hold it against them.

[jelly]

I went to a church this summer where the only mention of pop culture was to tell everyone how much of an abomination it was. And music with drums! Don't get me started on the evils of music with drums.

I don't believe music with drums is evil. This is merely a stance held by some sheltering families that I don't believe is entirely sinful.

While it may not be 'sinful', I would argue that it's ignorant to the point of harm. I'm honestly quite tired of people going, "yeah I may be sheltered to the extreme, but at least I'm not sinning", because you're clearly harvesting a self-protect mindset that isn't beneficial to anyone else. Jesus didn't merely call us to be holy.. he called us to be missional.

For the love of God, shatter your delusional world of safety and relate to people who are searching for Christ! They don't want to see that your life reflects rules of 'do not's, they want to see that your passion for your faith supersedes your self-protect mode! The heart and soul of Jesus Christ can be found and accessed through the most potent R-rated films you can imagine. I'm hardly saying that we need to drop all our barriers simply so we can be more like the world; I'm wholeheartedly suggesting that we fully embrace the fact the Jesus is out on the streets interacting with prostitutes with a greater passion than ministering to a church full of people who would rather sit at home and criticize foul language. What's the priority here?