New movie on intellignet design versus evolution...

[mike_rowe]

Sit back and relax Jared, I'll handle this one.

i have met him too, no disrespect but he is not like u discribed.
he took time to go outside with us, he nails every detail because he gets
his info from the bible(kjv) but i don't what to say about his being in jail,
i heard from my dad about that, i'll ask him for details. u should listen to his stuff, you sound sorta against him , i hope your not! I take it that how he handled the whole tax thingy is his way and opinion, just like some people think its alright to have drums in the church.

no disrespect, just my view.

[Jonathan]

i have met him too, no disrespect but he is not like u discribed.

Then I guess you and I had very different experiences

you sound sorta against him , i hope your not!

I won't deny it--I sorta am.

Rest easy though, I came to this position through research and listening to him, so it's not like it's an uninformed stance.

I take it that how he handled the whole tax thingy is his way and opinion, just like some people think its alright to have drums in the church.

The difference being having drums in church isn't against the law--refusing to pay income tax and scheming to keep from having to pay income tax is.

no disrespect, just my view.

I've never seen that smiley before--talk about perfect for debates ^_^

Just out of curiosity, under what circumstances did you get to meet him?

[Rio]

I just say that no one or their opinions are perfect.

I do like Kent Hovind though, both sam and I met him in '02 and He posed with us for a picture.
He and my dad were in contact and he even wanted to be in one of my dads films but that was all before he was thrown in jail....

[mike_rowe]

i met him at a church downtown

uuh donut! but i hate jelly donuts

[Kairi]

I really liked this movie! Especially the weird theories about how life came to be, and the Casino of Life cartoon. I have one question about the crystal theory however: where did the crystals come from? Hmmmmm? And the alien theory: where did the aliens come from?
It was also pretty funny watching Richard Dawkins squirm like a bug under a microscope in that final debate.

[J-man]

I really enjoyed it - I didn't think it was boring at all! But then I like that sort of thing, so...what I don't find boring, you might.


EDIT: Hey, that reminded me of the evolutionist who vocally expressed how UTTERLY BORING he found ID. "Can you imagine the BOREDOM?!"

I found him rather boring. Maybe not boring, but..

So my dad took me to see Expelled last saturday (it was for my birthday..). I enjoyed it.. I think the point wasn't so much that ID is right, but that there's no room for it to be right, if it is. The part about the nazis I found probably the most interesting, I like history. And that guy lives in Paris, he was cool.

Oh, and did anyone find that lady (I think her name was Eugenie..) annoying? I've seen her in some other informative video, and I found her annoying in that too.. Just.. Gahhh...

[Iron and Light]

I have never met Kent Hovind, but I have seen his videos and dvds since I was very young. Whatever Mr. Hovind has done in his own personal life should not in any way invalidate the message in his videos. He is still extremely knowledgeable, and all of the information contained in those videos is scientifically proven. This was just a case of a mighty man for God falling into sin- no different than King David, and he was a man 'after God's own heart.' We in the Christian community should be praying for him, and for his ministry to continue as I'm sure the destruction of it was Satan's goal all along.
As far as him not listening to the other side, he used to do that all the time. He even has a debate series in which he debated 'the other side' professors and scientists. I DO know that he said in his videos how he had a very hard time listening to them because what they had to say made no sense, all of the evolution believing people contradicted themselves, and 90% of the time when he would ask them questions, they didn't even know WHAT they believed.
So even though God has allowed this man to be humbled because of his sin, we should not 'throw the baby out with the bath water' so-to-speak, and totally ignore the truth that is contained in those videos. Those videos are very powerful. We have seen many people come to Christ after viewing them. Try to remember that Satan knows this, and that is why all of this has happened. The Bible tells us to see things through Spiritual eyes, and that's what we should do with this.

[Laura Ingalls]

I really enjoyed it - I didn't think it was boring at all! But then I like that sort of thing, so...what I don't find boring, you might.


EDIT: Hey, that reminded me of the evolutionist who vocally expressed how UTTERLY BORING he found ID. "Can you imagine the BOREDOM?!"

I found him rather boring. Maybe not boring, but..

I found his last little rant incredibly sad. Now his brain tumor is back, and he believes there is no life after death, no purpose, no hope...

It's just...sad.

[Jonathan]

This was just a case of a mighty man for God falling into sin- no different than King David, and he was a man 'after God's own heart.'

You'd have a point, except for the little inconvenient fact that he's been brazenly breaking the law for well over a decade and has yet to show a repentant attitude. Not to mention his attitude in court.

And his quick little speech before heading to jail, which served only to ask people to send him money, doesn't count as repentance, in my opinion.

We in the Christian community should be praying for him,

Very true.

As far as him not listening to the other side, he used to do that all the time. He even has a debate series in which he debated 'the other side' professors and scientists.

He'll argue with the other side, sure, but not well.

A great example is the fossil record. There is one. No question about it. That's scientific fact.

The disagreement comes in when asking what this record tells us. Obviously, creationists and evolutionists disagree on what this record tells us.

To have any kind of constructive debate with an evolutionist, a creationist doesn't do himself any favors by denying the fossil record exists.

Kent is a good example of this. He flatly denied to me, in the course of our rather short conversation, that the fossil record existed, and tried to convince me it was a lie made up by evolutionists.

Men like that arguing with evolutionists do not do our side any favors, no matter what his belief. I know of at least one science professor at my school that refuses to consider creation at all because of Kent's attitude on the fossil record alone.

We can go on and on about how knowledgeable Kent is and how great his speaking skills are--because he is and they are. But his behavior while debating or in presentations does much to invalidate the cause of creationists.

I'll end this by saying it's notable that he's rather controversial among even Christians and creationists.

So even though God has allowed this man to be humbled because of his sin, we should not 'throw the baby out with the bath water' so-to-speak,

Nor shall I. In this case, I believe, throwing out the baby with the bathwater would be to turn one's back on creation because of Kent. I do not doubt creation. I'm just not a fan of this particular "creationist".

[Iron and Light]

CSE News Article

Maybe things aren't exactly as they seemed, but God is using it for His glory...

[Jonathan]

No offense or anything, but an article from the Dr.Dino site probably isn't the best to use to convince me

Maybe things aren't exactly as they seemed

I'm afraid I don't understand what you were saying there--what isn't as it seems?

[Iron and Light]

I would just ask you to pray and read it, and try to overlook where it came from.

Just remember that the media is Satan's playground, and is not going to report accurately in a very out-spoken Christian's court-case.
Also, how can Wesley Snipes, who owed FAR more (millions, to be exact) to the IRS, get three years, when Kent Hovind gets ten? There's something wrong there. No matter what you think of him, he was making an impact for Christ, and Satan was not happy. If you're reading the article, during the first three months he was in jail while waiting to be sent to a bigger prison, seventeen out of the twenty-two guys that were in there with him received Christ, so God is definitely using this for the good.

[Jonathan]

Also, how can Wesley Snipes, who owed FAR more (millions, to be exact) to the IRS, get three years, when Kent Hovind gets ten? There's something wrong there.

I didn't know who Snipes was and had to look him up. An actor--no wonder I didn't know of him

The answer to your question though is a simple one: they were charged with different crimes.

Snipes was charged with one count of conspiring to defraud the US, one count of knowingly making or aiding and abetting the making of a false and fraudulent claim for payment against the United States, and six counts of willfully failing to file Federal income tax returns by their filing dates.

Hovind, on the other hand, was charged with twelve counts of willful failure to collect, account for, and pay over Federal income taxes and FICA taxes, forty-five counts of knowingly structuring transactions in Federally-insured financial institutions to evade the reporting requirements, and one count of corruptly endeavoring to obstruct and impede the administration of the internal revenue laws.

Snipes charged with a total of 8 counts, Hovind charged with a total of 48 counts. Common sense dictates that he'd be facing more jail time.

Included in Hovind's charges were twelve charges for failing to pay employee-related taxes, totaling $473,818, and 45 of the charges were for evading reporting requirements by making multiple cash withdrawals just under the $10,000 reporting requirement (a technique known as "smurfing").

So yes, Snipes owed more, but Hovind was guilty of more obstruction, rendering him likely to receive more jail time.

No matter what you think of him, he was making an impact for Christ,

Even if this is true, I cannot bring myself to view him as a credible man, partly because of how he handles disagreements, partly because of his very long list of legal troubles (all the charges I listed up there were only from the 2006 trials--I've mentioned in an earlier post that this wasn't the first trouble he's had with the law, no, far from it), partly because many reputable creationists find fault with him, and partly because of controversial comments he himself has made (example, 9/11 was carried out by the gov't, and you all know how I feel about such theories). Even if he's a Christian, he's not one I'm impressed by, nor am I obligated to be impressed with him.

This says nothing how I feel about creation, just this particular creationist.

[mike_rowe]

u need to give kent hovind a break, by saying that it was the gov't fault that 911 happened, he was probably talking about bill clinton when he had the chance to take out osama binladden but didn't, thats just what i think, just give people like me and iron and light a chance, this is all only my opinion.
no offense

[Jonathan]

u need to give kent hovind a break, by saying that it was the gov't fault that 911 happened, he was probably talking about bill clinton when he had the chance to take out osama binladden but didn't, thats just what i think,

Nope, that wasn't it:

With Pearl Harbor I think our people know full well it was coming. They always have a cover story, of course. [...] They knew full well Pearl Harbor was going to be bombed. [....] They wanted that to bring us into the war. So I think people wanted very much something like 9-11. Whether those specific buildings or not, I don't know. A lot of shady stuff, like the buildings, I understand, were sold or something or insurance policies taken out, you know, just a few weeks before that. Buildings that hold 50,000 people only had, you know, 3000 killed. Lot of folks were told not to come to work. Somebody knew what was going on. [8]

just give people like me and iron and light a chance, this is all only my opinion.
no offense

None taken Also, keep in mind that I'm not personally attacking you either. I may disagree with you guys, but I don't mean any offense to you either.

****************************

We've been side-tracked on Mr. Hovind for some time now, and I forgot something: Jared, Elrohir and I have un-answered questions.

[nick mullugan]

well it was alight but it was boring the second time around lol i fell asleep but it made some great points and i love how he made richard dawkins look dumb

[Clodius Albinus]

A hint: when a third-rate actor makes a genius look dumb, it probably has much more to do with deception and selective editing than anything else. That's definitely the case here.

Incidentally, Ron Bailey has a brief writeup of the film in the July issue of Reason Magazine, going after it for perhaps the most offensive (and idiotic) claim: that belief in evolution was a necessary (if not sufficient) cause of the worst atrocities of the 20th century.

[nick mullugan]

i know i wasnt being sarcastic really did love how he really made him look dumb and one other thing dont you thinks its s stretch to even call him third rate lol

I really enjoyed it - I didn't think it was boring at all! But then I like that sort of thing, so...what I don't find boring, you might.


EDIT: Hey, that reminded me of the evolutionist who vocally expressed how UTTERLY BORING he found ID. "Can you imagine the BOREDOM?!"

I found him rather boring. Maybe not boring, but..

really i found him the most interesting because he was a stupid hick who didnt understand a thing of science and they put him on camera just so people could see his ignorance but i did find it really sad about his brain tumor but if i had to gusse he has proboly picked up a Bible instead of a gun because he did know a little bit about it from his youth



Combined double post ~V-lady

[Clodius Albinus]

really i found him the most interesting because he was a stupid hick who didnt understand a thing of science and they put him on camera just so people could see his ignorance

A Guggenheim Fellow doesn't know a thing about his field. Glad you cleared that up for us.

[nick mullugan]

really i found him the most interesting because he was a stupid hick who didnt understand a thing of science and they put him on camera just so people could see his ignorance

A Guggenheim Fellow doesn't know a thing about his field. Glad you cleared that up for us.

ok well.. sorry to insult you intelegence