The Town of Odyssey

Just when I commit to returning to the Town of Odyssey, my own work-life became increasingly busy and it's been a bit hectic to actually get the time to start looking into things around here, but I managed to find the time to listen to "51: Take it From the Top!" as part of my Album Review Pledge and now I'm turning my attention towards The Town of Odyssey itself. And, for those afraid of change, you might want to have a seat. Because what I'm about to suggest involves a lot of it, and I realize some of it might be controversial (likely more so for newer residents than those who remember how things once were).

The Town of Odyssey was originally created to address many issues that existed on The Town Hall of the old days. A more detailed account can be found here for those who are interested in the history of this place. The idea was to foster a community of fun, excitement, and discovery (where have we heard that before?) and provide a place that children (and adults!) could visit and have fun. It was created over 9 years ago and the internet has changed a great deal since then, and this place is beginning to show signs of age. Fortunately, in my absence, Darcie and EK did upgrade the board to a more respectable version, but even that upgrade was performed several years ago and the Town is long overdue for another upgrade. Which is going to be my first order of business.

Potential Possibilities
As many of you know, there are many, many modifications installed in the town to make things better, and many of these mods won't work on a new board. I'm trying to find a proper balance between the features that exist on this board and the new features that are offered with the latest version of PHPBB, along with all the new extensions that come with it. This does mean that some things will be lost, but my guess is that many of the features are not that well used to begin with. There is a lot of modern enhancements to the latest version of PHPBB and ones that I think you'll all like, but I also understand and appreciate the history of the board and I'm going to do my best to ensure I do as much as possible to keep some things around. The big question mark right now is the monetary system used here. Money doesn't seem as essential as it once was, but it's also a popular feature that differentiates this board from other places and I'd love to have your feedback on whether or not you feel this is a feature you could live without. This is not something that will not come easily, and I'd likely have to program something myself to get it to work, but I'm looking at an alternate "rewards" system as well. Other than running in the election, is money really used for anything around here anymore?

Not-So-Trivial Pursuits
Now, not surprisingly, I don't have a timeframe for when all of this is going to happen. But that doesn't mean I'm not procrastinating and I'll get to it when I get to it. In fact, it might interest everyone to know that I've already started the upgrade process on a parallel version of the board and should have a working version of the (not yet officially released) latest PHPBB by the end of the day. Once I've got a properly working version, I'll start comparing/contrasting the two boards and seeing where things need to be nipped and tucked and figure out how large of a task it's going to be to move everything over for good. One extreme possibility is that we might need to rebuild from scratch. I'm going to try and avoid this, but I'd be curious what everyone's thoughts would be if we were to archive the Town of Odyssey like we did with the Town Hall (it would be exactly like it is today, but it would be read-only) and starting brand new. As I mentioned, this is an extreme measure, but it could be the reboot this town needs.

Broken Armed and Dangerous
Something else that I think needs to be done is a significant amount of Spring Cleaning. I find the large amounts of categories and sub forums makes for a complicated labyrinth that no longer needs to exist. When traffic was at an all time high, it was difficult to keep up with all the threads popping up and the solution at the time was to group threads together to keep everything organized. But now, we have more sub categories than we have posts on a daily basis, and that's alarming. By consolidating boards, I think we will see an increase in traffic and activity on your posts, as threads that would otherwise be lost will now be highlighted and have more attention drawn to them. I think City Hall is certainly do for a complete overhaul, as is Old Gower Road. I'm even thinking Harlequin and Finneman's Market might make sense to combine, as both are more "General Discussion" and there's not dozens of new threads a day in either board that would make things difficult to follow. I also think we have too many mods installed in certain areas (like having two birthday announcement locations on the main page?!?) And the fact that if you click on a "Global Announcement" from the main page and can't actually reply to it is extremely annoying. I'm going to fix that too.

[Not] A Single Vote
Since this term is the first time in history where we were unable to get anyone on the ballot, and many people have requested I look into this, I am also going to review the election process here. If we do eliminate the money system, a new solution will need to be put into place to ensure the best candidates are running for Mayor/Chief of Police, and I have a few ideas. But I'd like to flesh them out a bit more before I announce anything, but I am looking at this.

Pink is Not My Color
Something else I haven't even started to draw up plans for, but would like to do, is build a new default theme for this place. The fact the "cotton candy" theme I created 9 years ago (and I remember it being criticized even back in the testing days) is a little surprising! It won't be too drastic, and I think I wouldn't want to change it up that much anyway, but a modern logo and a few color/image tweaks here and there might be appreciated after all these years. Stay tuned on that front.

The Unraveling
Finally, something that I'm sure you've waiting for with baited breath is the announcement of the various moderators. I am proud to announce the appointment of the COUNCIL OF LEGENDS! In honor of the history of the Town of Odyssey, I am pleased to appoint legendary heroes and villains from the town's past to the council. Who are these mysterious moderators? Stay tuned for more information this week!

So how much does all of this scare you? Are you pleased? Disappointed? Unsure? I want all the feedback I can get. This is a community and I don't want to disrupt things too much, but I think a shakeup is needed for this aging place and I only have the best on intentions, but I'd love any and all feedback you have.

The one thing I have strong feelings on in this list is archiving the board. I'm all for upgrading and I appreciate how big a pain that process can be. But one of the biggest differences this place has from the other message boards across my various fandoms is the years of history on the ToO. The fact that I can search for "pizza" and come up with over 2300 results is amazing. As you said that's an extreme possibility. But, my two cents would to be avoid it if at all feasible.

I definitely like the idea of consolidating. FM and the Harlequin are the only two I check on a daily basis.

As long as Catsville is an option, I'm okay with any themes.

I do have a question... Would all of this really be worth it?
I mean, I'm not against any of your ideas (except for getting rid of the money... I like the money system), it's just that I'm perfectly okay with how this place is now. It's a nice, small community, with a countable number of active users. I'm on several other message boards that have the amount activity that you're probably used to around here, and I have to say, I don't like it as much; it's a chore to keep track of people and threads, etc.
Are you simply wanting to do all this for nostalgic reasons? Not that nostalgia is bad, but I really don't think this place will ever live up to its former glory.
Would it really be so bad just to let the place die peacefully?
I mean, most of the people that I would be concerned about keeping up with, I'm friends with on Facebook, or I have their Email address. Sure, it would be sad, but I don't think it would be an awful thing if we just left the place to evolve as it will, and if it dies, it dies.

Like I said, I'm not opposed to most of the changes you suggested. I just think that maybe you're trying to hard for something that may never be.

-- Sun Jun 08, 2014 11:44 pm --

*EDIT:

Shadowpaw wrote: And the fact that if you click on a "Global Announcement" from the main page and can't actually reply to it is extremely annoying. I'm going to fix that too.

I have never had an issue with this... In fact, I never knew this ever was an issue...
*Goes to check*

*EDIT:
I can post in a global announcement, even after clicking on it from the main page... Idk what's wrong with your page.
I'm in Greyscale, btw, if that makes a difference.

I like the money. I like to look at how rich I'm getting. I can't do that in the real world.

Keep it, plz.

Other than that, it doesn't really matter with me

/helpful

Knight Fisher wrote:The one thing I have strong feelings on in this list is archiving the board. I'm all for upgrading and I appreciate how big a pain that process can be. But one of the biggest differences this place has from the other message boards across my various fandoms is the years of history on the ToO. The fact that I can search for "pizza" and come up with over 2300 results is amazing. As you said that's an extreme possibility. But, my two cents would to be avoid it if at all feasible.

I definitely like the idea of consolidating. FM and the Harlequin are the only two I check on a daily basis.

I agree with both of these opinions (except I also check Whit's End on a regular basis too).

~JCGJ~ wrote:Would it really be so bad just to let the place die peacefully?

Yes.

Shadowpaw wrote: And the fact that if you click on a "Global Announcement" from the main page and can't actually reply to it is extremely annoying. I'm going to fix that too.

I have never had an issue with this... In fact, I never knew this ever was an issue...
*Goes to check*

*EDIT:
I can post in a global announcement, even after clicking on it from the main page... Idk what's wrong with your page.
I'm in Greyscale, btw, if that makes a difference.

I have the same problem Shadowpaw has. To reply to a global announcement I have to go find it's home subforum and enter the thread there.

Keep the money. Tis a must unless there is another great option which I doubt.

The rest are fine with me.

I'm fine with all the things that you mentioned, except no more money. I love the money system. Also, I think it'd be cool if there was a complete reboot. Then newer members (like myself) have a chance to catch up with the post number of those who have thousands of posts.

Shadowpaw wrote:So how much does all of this scare you?

A lot. When you said you were looking at changes, I thought you meant in how we do things, like the Election format, not actual changes to our very existence.

Removing the money:
I am strongly opposed to the idea. The money is one of the key features that not only distinguishes this board from others, but that highlights the uniqueness of the board itself in that this isn’t just another internet forum, it’s a virtual town.

Archiving the site:
I am infinitely opposed to the idea. Starting over from scratch would be disastrous, I honestly don’t know how you could even consider it. (I’m not trying to be extreme, I’m truly that alarmed/confused by the prospect.) If your aim is to boost activity, how is it a good idea to remove all activity to date; not to even consider the terrible consequence of not having direct access to our historical threads.

Combining FM and HT:
I am moderately to strongly opposed to the idea:
You say they’re both for general discussion, but they aren’t. FM is for general, HT is for media. HT can be hard enough to sort through at times since all media is simply dumped in there, the board would be an unmanageable mess if the anything-and-everything threads of FM were piled on top of it.

Global announcement problem:
I have the same issue, but it’s my understanding it only occurs on some of the board styles, others route through the proper forum and let you post. I only use the default theme though, so I can’t verify that first hand.

Review of the Election system:
I am for the idea. The idea of a review. It certainly needs some tweaking, however I don’t know if a complete overhaul is called for just now. Remember that there could have been a Team in this Election, the bid was simply reconsidered under the circumstances. So the empty ballot isn’t entirely from lack of interest and/or an entirely broken system.

New default theme:
I am for the idea - with one stipulation. That you leave the current theme in place. Make something else the default, sure, but let this one still be used. This is what I have used for my entire eight years here; this is what the ToO looks like to me.

I'm so excited by all of this! Can't wait for the next ToOnaissance!!

Jonathan wrote:

~JCGJ~ wrote:

Shadowpaw wrote: And the fact that if you click on a "Global Announcement" from the main page and can't actually reply to it is extremely annoying. I'm going to fix that too.

I have never had an issue with this... In fact, I never knew this ever was an issue...
*Goes to check*

*EDIT:
I can post in a global announcement, even after clicking on it from the main page... Idk what's wrong with your page.
I'm in Greyscale, btw, if that makes a difference.

I have the same problem Shadowpaw has. To reply to a global announcement I have to go find it's home subforum and enter the thread there.

It's only a problem on newToO. I was able to make edits to the other styles to fix it. It's Shadowpaw's fault for making City Hall the first forum and unable to be posted to by regular members.

I am a bit uneasy about your ideas. But I am really happy different options are being considered, because I agree, this place needs some uplifting. So something must be done.

However...

bookworm wrote:Removing the money:
I am strongly opposed to the idea. The money is one of the key features that not only distinguishes this board from others, but that highlights the uniqueness of the board itself in that this isn’t just another internet forum, it’s a virtual town.

Exactly. Please don't get rid of the monetary system if you can help it. That is one big thing that keeps this place feeling like a town. Plus owning a shop would be pointless without money. I seriously would not want to come here anymore if it lost its town atmosphere.

bookworm wrote:Archiving the site:
I am infinitely opposed to the idea. Starting over from scratch would be disastrous, I honestly don’t know how you could even consider it. (I’m not trying to be extreme, I’m truly that alarmed/confused by the prospect.) If your aim is to boost activity, how is it a good idea to remove all activity to date; not to even consider the terrible consequence of not having direct access to our historical threads.

Again, what bookie said. I actually think that will make activity WORSE.

bookworm wrote:Combining FM and HT:
I am moderately to strongly opposed to the idea:
You say they’re both for general discussion, but they aren’t. FM is for general, HT is for media. HT can be hard enough to sort through at times since all media is simply dumped in there, the board would be an unmanageable mess if the anything-and-everything threads of FM were piled on top of it.

Agreed. I think the media related things need to stay in their own section. Makes things much easier to look at and search.

bookworm wrote:Review of the Election system:
I am for the idea. The idea of a review. It certainly needs some tweaking, however I don’t know if a complete overhaul is called for just now. Remember that there could have been a Team in this Election, the bid was simply reconsidered under the circumstances. So the empty ballot isn’t entirely from lack of interest and/or an entirely broken system.

Yes, I think some tweaking needs to be done.. but totally revamping is probably unnecessary. Though, I am up to hearing any ideas you have on the subject, Shadowpaw.

bookworm wrote:New default theme:
I am for the idea - with one stipulation. That you leave the current theme in place. Make something else the default, sure, but let this one still be used. This is what I have used for my entire eight years here; this is what the ToO looks like to me.

I DEFINITELY think the theme needs to be updated. PLEASE. IT LOOKS SOO OLD. Though, 90% of the time I use Grayscale.. I really hate looking at the default theme when I am not logged in. But, it might be nice to keep the original theme (along with an updated theme) if only for history's sake.

bookworm wrote:Archiving the site:
I am infinitely opposed to the idea. Starting over from scratch would be disastrous, I honestly don’t know how you could even consider it. (I’m not trying to be extreme, I’m truly that alarmed/confused by the prospect.) If your aim is to boost activity, how is it a good idea to remove all activity to date; not to even consider the terrible consequence of not having direct access to our historical threads.

We would definitely have direct access to the historical threads, as the site as we see it today would be kept in a locked state with everything the way it is.

The reason that a reboot would not be as disastrous as you might expect, is that a reboot would regenerate threads that have long been lost. When the Town of Odyssey was created, it was a huge success and set all kinds of records in the early days... many of the threads already existed on the Town Hall, but people were not being penalized for "duplicate" topics or needing to search through the forums to find out if a topic of discussion had already been discussed. It's a fresh way to encourage new activity.

But that said, that's an extreme measure as I pointed out. That's not the goal. And it's mainly to elicit feedback, which seems mixed at the moment.

Though clearly a points system is still very important to everyone, which is good to know!

I am up for any changes and look forward to most of them. Like a "like" button!

Saying I oppose a complete reboot of the board would be stating it too strongly, but I'd prefer not to--because bumping threads annually is all I have to do these days. It isn't really a bad thing, necessarily... I have seen boards start over and thrive and do great, and seen them start over and be totally dead within a month or two. In the cases where they died though it was probably a case of too little too late.

I love the money feature please don't get rid of it,
I'm in odyssian and i'm posting right now so....
Tweaking the election might be fine, depending on what the tweaks are..
Making a new default theme would be cool.. If you are doing this you should remake Regisville.
Plus, maybe make a Cotton Candy blue, and Cotton Candy pink..
I'm not sure about everything else...
Also, if we get rid of the money feature, how will we pay for siggys, avvies and other stuff to customize your profile.
Also, I'm kind of curious, will we be able to have bigger avatars?
Another bug that needs fixed is you edit and lose money..
Also, maybe Jobs could make a reapperance?

I'm totes cool with all of this with the exception of two things. I just have some concerns to throw out there.

The monetary system: I do think that right now, with the current state of the board, the monetary system is pretty useless. Crestwood is all but dead. Admin teams no longer release special edition items (like dolls and stuff). Contests and games aren't as common as they used to be. BUT, if we manage to get the board back up to speed and increase engagement and participation, the money system would go back to being awesome. That being said, I don't think it necessarily has to be called "money." If there was some other reward-type system that would allow points or something like that to be exchanged like the money is, I think that could suffice.

Basically the money used to have an actual use. It doesn't so much anymore.

Archiving: This would make me pretty sad. While we'd still be able to go back and read through old threads, it wouldn't be the same. We have so many threads (Like the Post a Picture of Yourself thread) that have been around forever. They have history. I like being able to go back and bump up some of the old, super fun threads that are hanging around in the background. Right now, the history of the ToO is living and breathing. Part of the main board. You are thinking that archiving would be a "reset" the board needs. From my perspective, I think archiving everything will kill what little participation we have left on the ToO.

Kait wrote:You are thinking that archiving would be a "reset" the board needs. From my perspective, I think archiving everything will kill what little participation we have left on the ToO.

Pretty much this. A cold reboot is like the exact opposite of an injection of activity. It would bring what we do have to an abrupt halt.
At the start of all this you said the goal was to make the site harder for people to leave. If we close everything up and start over it would be easier to leave, because there would be nothing retroactive to stay for. The major part of my ToO existence is managing old threads.

darcie wrote:It's only a problem on newToO. I was able to make edits to the other styles to fix it. It's Shadowpaw's fault for making City Hall the first forum and unable to be posted to by regular members.

You obviously didn't try hard enough.

Ladies and gentlemen, I have fixed the announcement thread on the main page! You may now all click on links on the main page without fear of being unable to reply!

Just like that? Why didn't someone bring you in when the feature was implemented?

What about the bug that makes you lose money when you edit your post..

I doubt that can be fixed, since we can't figure out what actually causes it in the first place.

bookworm wrote:Just like that? Why didn't someone bring you in when the feature was implemented?

You'd be amazed at how powerful I am.

A-ty6 wrote:What about the bug that makes you lose money when you edit your post..

Can you give me more information about it? I'm sure I can figure it out. When does it happen?